Hypothetical

[Curiously Engaging Bob]

You're happily skating in a session and decided to take a break in the stand. You observe from afar an interaction between a mum and her 10 year old figure skating daughter practising her routine. You have seen them before in the rink. The little girl trains tirelessly, waking up before sunrise for practice and spends countless hours perfecting her spins and jumps. She is an amazing skater and wins most of her comps. You watch on and observe her "Tiger Mum" yelling and criticising her every time she makes even the smallest mistake, calling her lazy, careless and slow. The little girl is in tears. Her mum threatens her with no dinner tonight and no friends for the rest of the week if she doesn't get it right.

What would you do? If they're of a different ethnicity, would it be considered culturally inappropriate to comment?
What if, instead of being her mum, this was her coach? Would it make a difference to how you'll react?

[black]

Delegate to the coaches/steward/rink management.

“Hey coach, I saw a parent being disruptive the other day, and their child was rather upset; I think you should consider stepping in if you see it happen again, and ask them to tone it down; remind them of training etiquette. Ta”

If this was a coach -> https://www.iceskating.org.uk/safeguarding

The right action for the wrong reasons is still wrong.
The wrong action for the right reasons is no better.

[transmissionoftheflame]

Any external intervention in what goes on between parent and child is IMO likely to be counterproductive unless it's done with great subtlety - something that is not realistically possible if you're just some random person they don't know, or even if you're a coach or rink staff.  They will just get defensive, cross with the kid, go to another rink, etc.  Perhaps calling them out might set them on a path to realising that they not been behaving in a helpful way.


Ideally I think you would want to model excellent behaviour and hope it rubs off on people.


Training etiquette - yes, but let's say it's in a public session  "Training etiquette" doesn't apply.  It's just a private interaction, albeit in public.

[black]

I was lucky enough to attend a couple of demos/clinics featuring Monty Roberts a while back.
One of the things he mentioned was, "you can't blame people for doing the only thing they know how to do"

unless it's done with great subtlety

How about reading a copy of The Inner Game of Tennis by Timothy Gallwey nearby?

Ideally I think you would want to model excellent behaviour and hope it rubs off on people.

Agreed.

[transmissionoftheflame]

That's a great book - applies to any sport or human activity

[Curiously Engaging Bob]

Delegate to the coaches/steward/rink management.

“Hey coach, I saw a parent being disruptive the other day, and their child was rather upset; I think you should consider stepping in if you see it happen again, and ask them to tone it down; remind them of training etiquette. Ta”

If this was a coach -> https://www.iceskating.org.uk/safeguarding

The right action for the wrong reasons is still wrong.
The wrong action for the right reasons is no better.

Except, what standard are you using to determine that the parent is being disruptive. If a parents scolds a child and the child is upset. Is that always considered bad parenting and abuse? I've seen parents yell at their kids, and threatened to withhold their meal until they clean their room. The kid may cry or be very upset. Do you consider that child abuse? DO you think the coaches/ring management or stewarts would have any better idea of determining this than you?

[Curiously Engaging Bob]

Any external intervention in what goes on between parent and child is IMO likely to be counterproductive unless it's done with great subtlety - something that is not realistically possible if you're just some random person they don't know, or even if you're a coach or rink staff.  They will just get defensive, cross with the kid, go to another rink, etc.  Perhaps calling them out might set them on a path to realising that they not been behaving in a helpful way.


Ideally I think you would want to model excellent behaviour and hope it rubs off on people.


Training etiquette - yes, but let's say it's in a public session  "Training etiquette" doesn't apply.  It's just a private interaction, albeit in public.

What if this behaviour achieves the best success for the child. If you look at the Asian Americans, they're amongst the most successful race group in US based on education, income and other criteria people assign success to. These parents love the children dearly and sacrifice their whole life entirely for the "supposed" benefit of the child. This is how Asian culture work. Should this be considered excellent behaviour based on success?

[transmissionoftheflame]

What if this behaviour achieves the best success for the child. If you look at the Asian Americans, they're amongst the most successful race group in US based on education, income and other criteria people assign success to. These parents love the children dearly and sacrifice their whole life entirely for the "supposed" benefit of the child. This is how Asian culture work. Should this be considered excellent behaviour based on success?

I would not personally consider it excellent, and would try not to behave like that myself, and would probably feel sorry for the kid, but I would probably not "intervene" in any way other than just doing things differently myself.  I suppose if I had a very good friend who did that stuff I might raise other ways of approaching such things with them, but I am not sure I know anyone well enough to stick my oar in, unless directly asked for advice.  As to the wider debate regarding "success" - I think there are tradeoffs.  Overall, I prefer "our" way (I'm in the UK) - but then that's what I've grown up with.  I certainly have no interest in imposing "British values" on the rest of the world.

[black]

what standard are you using to determine that the parent is being disruptive.

The yelling part; totally fine for watching a pro hockey match; not cool for figure practice.

DO you think the coaches/ring management or stewarts would have any better idea of determining this than you?

Hopefully they should; it's probably not the first instance of this kind of behaviour that they've encountered; ice rinks attract all types.
They also have up-to-date first aid training, liability insurance, and enhanced DBS clearance for working with children.
One of their job qualities should be, to be an excellent 'people person' - you know, talk to, & get on with everyone.

Hypothetically speaking, if you knew who the child's coach was, would you contact them?

[VisuallyImpairedOnIce]

As someone who's done a couple of safeguarding courses for various jobs:


If I saw a situation like this, I'd speak to a coach, or ideally I'd find out who at the rink was the designated safeguarding lead and speak to them, something along the lines of "I've seen XYZ behaviour from parent X, I'm a little concerned about it, and wanted you to be aware."


After that, you've played your part. Safeguarding is important, and although this kind of interaction may only be a snapshot, it could be a piece in a bigger puzzle. Coaches/rinks can then reach out to other agencies with their concerns and it can progress from there, if necessary.


My thought is, if this is how a parent is treating a child in public, what's going on behind closed doors?


Better to pass on concerns and it be nothing, than stay quiet in my opinion.