Author Topic: What did you do in today's lesson?  (Read 354129 times)

WednesdayMarch

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3300 on: May 22, 2018, 09:58:29 am »
So everybody's doing Ina Bauers at the moment?  I'm going to have to raise my game because mine are woeful...  :o   ;D

I'm off to skate at Gosport this morning.  I haven't skated there since my accident (which was at Basingstoke) in 1999.  It's going to be weird.  But after Plymouth and Eden, it'll be lovely to skate on a normal shaped rink!
Returned to the ice in Sept 2017 after a major leg injury in 1999. Skating in Jackson Elite Pro & MK Vision Syncro. Still scary after all these years.

VisuallyImpairedOnIce

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3301 on: July 27, 2018, 04:55:54 pm »
Saturday group lesson:
Backwards crossovers to landing position on both sides
Backwards crossovers in a figure of eight
3 jump
Salchow entry and concept
Toe loop entry and concept


Wednesday private lesson:
Worked on 3 jump from backwards crossovers
Went through salchow and toe loop - not really jumping these yet
1 foot spin - finally felt the momentum you’re supposed to get before pulling in. Kinda scary!


My current coach doesn’t have a regular slot for me, so we’ve agreed I’m going to switch over to our other fully qualified coach for my 1 to 1 lessons - Saturday group coach isn’t quite there so can’t do 1 to 1, only small groups. This other coach does my Saturday morning performance/show skating group session so I know him well. He’s super excited, so we’re having a lesson on Thursday.
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Leif

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3302 on: August 01, 2018, 01:07:36 pm »
Not really today's lesson, but on Saturday a coach watched my skating, and made some observations, and last night a really good skater did the same. Both reckon I move my feet too fast, which means I should slow down, take longer strides. I was doing forwards cross rolls perfectly, just too fast. Also the really good skater commented that my left leg is dominant. He's right, which is odd as I am right handed.

I anyone has tips on skating with slower legs, but as fast, please pass 'em on.

The Sacred Voice

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3303 on: August 07, 2018, 07:03:16 pm »
Not really today's lesson, but on Saturday a coach watched my skating, and made some observations, and last night a really good skater did the same. Both reckon I move my feet too fast, which means I should slow down, take longer strides. I was doing forwards cross rolls perfectly, just too fast. Also the really good skater commented that my left leg is dominant. He's right, which is odd as I am right handed.

I anyone has tips on skating with slower legs, but as fast, please pass 'em on.

I don't know how much truth there is in what I'm about to say, but in figure skating crossovers then I've been told that you're meant to really ride the edges of each foot throughout the movement, rather than swapping foot as fast as possible. I believe you generate power better and in a more controlled manner that way. However, I doubt this method would be any good for a hockey player as I assume you want to be able to change direction and react to situations much faster?

With forward crossrolls then I guess they just want you to hold each edge longer to demonstrate your ability to sustain and control a prolonged edge. I'd suggest that instead of bringing the free leg round fast for the change then let the free leg arc around your body slower, maybe take it out a touch wider as you bring it round so it has further to travel before it takes over.
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WednesdayMarch

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3304 on: August 07, 2018, 09:27:23 pm »
I anyone has tips on skating with slower legs, but as fast, please pass 'em on.

More/deeper kneebend and better use of edges should get you stronger pushes and more power; those equal speed.  When I trained at Basingstoke, I took two pushes from end to end.

There's a definite order and rhythm to good forward stroking, and it involves changing edge at the right moment and pushing from the inside edge.  I can't explain it in writing but I can teach it in person, which isn't much use here...  :(

Much the same goes for forward crossovers. 
Returned to the ice in Sept 2017 after a major leg injury in 1999. Skating in Jackson Elite Pro & MK Vision Syncro. Still scary after all these years.

Leif

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3305 on: August 08, 2018, 10:09:28 am »
More/deeper kneebend and better use of edges should get you stronger pushes and more power; those equal speed.  When I trained at Basingstoke, I took two pushes from end to end.

There's a definite order and rhythm to good forward stroking, and it involves changing edge at the right moment and pushing from the inside edge.  I can't explain it in writing but I can teach it in person, which isn't much use here...  :(

Much the same goes for forward crossovers.

Thanks, I do seem to be getting better edges on crossovers, and forwards skating now. I've booked a one hour one to one session with our hockey coach this Friday, and hopefully he can pick up on mistakes and areas to improve. I gave up on figure skating coaches. I do think people learn much quicker one to one with a coach going by people I see at the rink.

Interestingly the really good skater mentioned that skating to music helps as skating is about having a good stroking rhythm. I can see what he means especially when watching speed skaters.

I've also adopted a 'just do it' approach. During ice hockey someone said I should have shot when he gave me a pass. I said I can't shoot for peanuts. He said "Just shoot the [censored] puck". On another occasion someone said I should have transitioned from backwards defence to forwards. I said I can't transition at that speed. He said "Well you need to learn, so do it, and if you fall you're no worse off". It seems to be good advice, a lot of people seem scared to commit, and I have to admit to an element of that in my own skating, a belief that you can gradually learn a move when in fact it requires adopting an unstable position from the start. I suspect good figure skaters do this anyway since spins and jumps are so scary.  :o

The Sacred Voice

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3306 on: August 22, 2018, 12:50:30 am »
I've also adopted a 'just do it' approach. During ice hockey someone said I should have shot when he gave me a pass. I said I can't shoot for peanuts. He said "Just shoot the [censored] puck". On another occasion someone said I should have transitioned from backwards defence to forwards. I said I can't transition at that speed. He said "Well you need to learn, so do it, and if you fall you're no worse off". It seems to be good advice, a lot of people seem scared to commit, and I have to admit to an element of that in my own skating, a belief that you can gradually learn a move when in fact it requires adopting an unstable position from the start. I suspect good figure skaters do this anyway since spins and jumps are so scary.  :o

One of the things I've felt when learning with the other adult skaters at my rink is that those who are afraid to take risks with moves feel like they progress slower. If that is the case then that fear is completely understandable, many of us have lives that a broken bone would make more complicated (not to mention painful). I know a lot of parents at the rink who, were they to break a wrist and be unable to drive, wouldn't be able to get their kids to school as conveniently and that's just one aspect of their lives. Furthermore, broken bones aren't something that fix in a few weeks, it's months of recovery and inconvenience with day-to-day activities, all because of something that was only meant to be a hobby. Sadly, this risk doesn't change the fact that having the fear in the first place could mean you learn slower. I feel you're absolutely right to cite just doing it and getting into that awkward position and learn from that point, it's scary but productive I believe.

All that said, learning slower isn't all that bad either, it's not like any of us can go to the Olympics, so there's really no rush - although I think people can get put off the sport if they feel they're not improving, particularly if they've been working on similar things for a long time. I've been a long time advocate of "falling is learning" in skating, which does make me come off as insanely reckless on the ice, but I genuinely believe it's helped me get to grips with trickier moves faster - I also have the advantage of relatively few responsibilities at the moment (could be changing soon though...) so flinging myself around doesn't seem quite so risky to my mind.

On this topic, I've been learning backward 3 turns for a little while now and they're one of the first moves I've had to do that I've felt genuinely a bit nervous about entirely committing to (you have to put a disgusting amount of faith in a very small amount of blade contact through your heel to make the turn) and I've definitely had some lurchy moments as I've tried to do the turn and stumbled or caught something. I won't deny, those moments have felt horrible and I took one fall that was really painful, but I don't think I'd be where I am with them now without having had those experiences.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 12:41:02 pm by The Sacred Voice »
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The Sacred Voice

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3307 on: August 22, 2018, 01:24:00 am »
I would post in this thread more, but my lessons are quite same-y at the moment as I work on refinement. They essentially look like:

Warmups:
- Crossrolls (forwards and backwards)
- Slaloms (2 and 1 footed - forwards and backward)

Field moves:
- Alternating forward 3 turns followed by a crossover into the next 3 turn (in the level 4 field moves I believe - I'm doing both the inside and outside versions)
- Alternating inside mohawks followed by a crossover into the next mohawk (another field move but not sure which level)
- Backward 3 turn practice, the inside version I'm doing both directions but I'm just sticking to anticlockwise for the outside version (I think my coach is worried I'm going to break something doing the clockwise version after a fall I took once)

Jumps
- Everything up to and including single Lutz
- Loop is the big struggle at the moment. I've spent weeks adjusting my arm positioning, but now I'm letting my left shoulder come back to force the take off, instead of holding the arm forward and allowing the edge to twist me up and off the ice - a feeling I'm not entirely onboard with at the moment but I'm working on
- Flip is very variable, I did a good one today, but my practices in my own time are frequently plagued with inconsistency
- I find being warmed up more effectively thanks to my coach pushing me along means my muscles are much better prepared for doing the jumps and I tend to be a bit more consistent with them in lessons
- Rink was busy this week so we skipped Lutz, but Lutz is bizarrely becoming one of my favourite jumps - there's a lot of surprisingly satisfying stuff about its execution

Spins:
- I've put a plural in that heading, but it's more like spin, singular - my hilariously tragic upright spin ::)
- However, on that point, my upright spin is actually making some progress - a lot of experimentation has finally yielded some results. The big changes have been trying to avoid making any movement after making the entry turn into the spin. I've managed to create some stability following that point and since that moment I've been starting to get more control. It's honestly a huge breakthrough after a disgustingly long period of floundering around with it. I've never had any problem with making rotations, just the stability, so hopefully I should make some more consistent progress from here

And that's basically my lesson structure at the moment, so it's not much to post each week, but I am enjoying it!
I'm blogging about my skating journey, please read along at dontexcelaxel.blogspot.com

MonkeyBeaver

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3308 on: August 24, 2018, 09:00:40 pm »
One of the things I've felt when learning with the other adult skaters at my rink is that those who are afraid to take risks with moves feel like they progress slower. If that is the case then that fear is completely understandable, many of us have lives that a broken bone would make more complicated (not to mention painful). I know a lot of parents at the rink who, were they to break a wrist and be unable to drive, wouldn't be able to get their kids to school as conveniently and that's just one aspect of their lives. Furthermore, broken bones aren't something that fix in a few weeks, it's months of recovery and inconvenience with day-to-day activities, all because of something that was only meant to be a hobby. Sadly, this risk doesn't change the fact that having the fear in the first place could mean you learn slower. I feel you're absolutely right to cite just doing it and getting into that awkward position and learn from that point, it's scary but productive I believe.

All that said, learning slower isn't all that bad either, it's not like any of us can go to the Olympics, so there's really no rush - although I think people can get put off the sport if they feel they're not improving, particularly if they've been working on similar things for a long time. I've been a long time advocate of "falling is learning" in skating, which does make me come off as insanely reckless on the ice, but I genuinely believe it's helped me get to grips with trickier moves faster - I also have the advantage of relatively few responsibilities at the moment (could be changing soon though...) so flinging myself around doesn't seem quite so risky to my mind.

On this topic, I've been learning backward 3 turns for a little while now and they're one of the first moves I've had to do that I've felt genuinely a bit nervous about entirely committing to (you have to put a disgusting amount of faith in a very small amount of blade contact through your heel to make the turn) and I've definitely had some lurchy moments as I've tried to do the turn and stumbled or caught something. I won't deny, those moments have felt horrible and I took one fall that was really painful, but I don't think I'd be where I am with them now without having had those experiences.

Totally relate to the fear. If I break something on the ice I wouldn’t be able to work & being self employed that’s a big problem. I gave up lessons last October, partly because my son started hockey & as I’m sure plenty on here know, that’s not cheap, but also because of those backwards 3 turns.
I had decided to get all the way through the Skate excellence grades then just skate for fun with my boys. Part way through Grade 6 I had a fall on the ice, got my feet taken out from under me at the Gillingham rink while on holiday in Kent, which resulted in a badly damaged wrist that took 8 weeks to feel right again. Carried on skating & working through the healing & passed grades 6 & 7, then came the backwards 3s, I’d never felt so unstable & not in control of any skill before, the coach did say that hockey skates were not ideal for this but I’d managed forward 3s in them.  I was determined to get there but had another fall, onto the same wrist, felt like I’d set my healing back at least 2 weeks, so didn’t carry on when that block of lessons finished.

I will get there eventually, might even start up the lessons again, feel like my backwards outside edges need to be better so practicing those & trying backwards crossrolls too. The fear is still very much there for the backwards 3s, especially as I broke my wrist in a non skating related accident in May & couldn’t work for 6 weeks, really can’t afford to be injured again.

WednesdayMarch

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3309 on: August 25, 2018, 12:07:12 am »
Carried on skating & working through the healing & passed grades 6 & 7, then came the backwards 3s, I’d never felt so unstable & not in control of any skill before, the coach did say that hockey skates were not ideal for this but I’d managed forward 3s in them.

I'm sorry, you're attempting backwards three turns in hockey skates:o

Seriously, those things are properly scary in figure skates!

Had a discussion with a coach the other day about why I'm finding them difficult (some days are worse than others) and she pointed out that I'd probably never really done them much, being an ice dancer back in the 90s, so I have no muscle memory to fall back on, if you'll pardon the pun.  She also feels that tiny feet and dance blades may not be helping...

But in hockey skates?  Noooooooooooooo.  Nope.  I'm feeling sick just thinking about it!
Returned to the ice in Sept 2017 after a major leg injury in 1999. Skating in Jackson Elite Pro & MK Vision Syncro. Still scary after all these years.

The Sacred Voice

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Re: What did you do in today's lesson?
« Reply #3310 on: August 25, 2018, 01:31:17 am »
Like WednesdayMarch said, doing backward 3s in hockey skates is craaaaaaazy :o The only reason I feel vaguely okay even trying them is because free skating blades have a generous amount of blade off the back of the heel to give you a bit of leeway with how far back you position your weight for the turn. Dance and hockey blades are both shorter. I can't imagine a world in which I'd try that, particularly in hockey blades.

I had no idea that Skate Excellence put backward 3s so soon after forward 3s. In Skate UK then you do forward 3s around Skate UK 5/6, but backward 3s don't even show up until Field Moves 3, which is like 10 levels later if you do all of Skate UK and Skate Star before doing the Field Moves tests. You'd probably start learning them slightly earlier than that either way, but it's weird that Skate Excellence groups them basically together.

Just had a look through the Skate Excellence curriculum and in the same level you're meant to start forward & backward 3s (two-footed) then you also start rockers, counters and brackets (also two-footed). While I'm sure the introduction to them is nice, it still feels like overly technical knowledge to demand students to execute in order to pass a relatively early grade in the grand scheme of skating learning.
I'm blogging about my skating journey, please read along at dontexcelaxel.blogspot.com



 

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